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Philip Edwards



Joined: 20 Jun 2007
Posts: 210
Location: Cambridge/England

PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 5:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The latest news from the Enterprisemission.

http://www.enterprisemission.com/NPC-Russia.htm
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Carol Nistri



Joined: 16 Jun 2007
Posts: 3354

PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 6:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dunno Phil,Im with JimO on this one,if youve ever listend to Hoagland you would know what we mean,the guy talks a rapid fire delivery that makes it sound as if he were so full of facts he cant get it out fast enough,somewhere along the line people realized they were being duped by this guy who sees a correlation in numbers about everything connected with NASA. I thought for the longest time he was furious with NASA about something,then I thought no what hes actually doing is trying to breath life into NASA when no one actually gives a hoot what there doing anymore.
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HopoUK



Joined: 14 Oct 2007
Posts: 378
Location: Brixham, Devon, England

PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmmm, I've heard about the so called structures on the moon. My problem with this is that we have powerful telescopes all over the world, and yet we haven't see them. There's even a video on Disclose.tv of supposed structures filmed through a telescope, but it just looks all blurred to me, especially as the telescope is always moving, which makes it difficult to get a clear image. Convenient? Smile

No, I think they would have been noticed a long time ago if they had existed. I'm more inclined to believe that the Cydonia face of Mars, and the 3 " Pyramid " structures are more real than anything on the moon. Though I do hope that I'm proved wrong, because then it would be proof that we are not the first to visit our moon.
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Philip Edwards



Joined: 20 Jun 2007
Posts: 210
Location: Cambridge/England

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 1:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My view is that Richard Hoagland's heart is in the right place and that although he has lost credibility with a number of people due to posting a few extreme and fanciful topics, perhaps because he has not been abducted and has only scraps of information to work with, he remains true to the cause of alien disclosure despite perhaps having an eye to sell a book or two, but then he is only human and I do exactly the same thing. But this is just speculation I could be wrong. Whatever you think about Hoagland, Dr Ken Johnston is the star or jewel in the crown, he held a senior position at NASA up until recently. Skeptics are frustrated by Johnston, as I see it they have two choices- 1 Johnston is a liar but he held a senior position at NASA and this invokes a profundity of conspiracy theories which the skeptics will hate to acknowledge. Or 2 Johnston is telling the truth and he has been a key figure at NASA, the skeptics will try to ignore this fact but it will be very difficult to do. Overall I say there is no smoke without fire, so follow this news and anyway the aliens I met told me they had a base on the Moon, read my personal encounters story on this website where I mention the base on the Moon!
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Philip Edwards



Joined: 20 Jun 2007
Posts: 210
Location: Cambridge/England

PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 9:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Click on the link below to hear a podcast in which Richard Hoagland reveals just what he believes NASA found on the Moon.

http://www.theunexplained.tv/
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JimO



Joined: 25 Oct 2007
Posts: 28
Location: Galveston County, Texas, USA

PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 2:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Philip Edwards wrote:
...Whatever you think about Hoagland, Dr Ken Johnston is the star or jewel in the crown, he held a senior position at NASA up until recently. Skeptics are frustrated by Johnston, as I see it they have two choices- 1 Johnston is a liar but he held a senior position at NASA and this invokes a profundity of conspiracy theories which the skeptics will hate to acknowledge. Or 2 Johnston is telling the truth and he has been a key figure at NASA, the skeptics will try to ignore this fact but it will be very difficult to do. ...


These claims are very easy to check out. For example, here are two items about Johnston's claim about a PhD and about being a Marine test pilot.

I've submitted these to Bara's Dark_Mission blog but he's refused to post my results in recent days -- speculation on his motives is justified.

Message submitted Nov 28 // 11:52 AM CST

Let's review:

Thread started October 6, 2007 – Ken Johnston Answers Commentators Questions

Paragraph 3 line 6-7: “I hold …two advanced degrees from the Reformed Baptist Seminary, one in Theology and the other PhD in Metaphysics.”

Step one: Locate the “Reformed Baptist Seminary”, and ask if they grant PhDs at all. Academic dean Dr. Robert Gonzales says they do not (he does not even have to look of “Johnston” on a list, since the degree claimed by Johnston has never been granted by his school).

Step two: Bara posts “Stupid Blog Post - #2” on November 21, 8:23 AM, presenting a ‘deploma’ (right click the image, select ‘properties’, and read the file name – ‘deploma’) from a school NOW called “The Reform Baptist Theological Seminary” in Denver, Colorado.

Document image is here: http://bp1.blogger.com/_eaaXUONwoEA/R0RdX-3kHiI/AAAAAAAAAFs/IkbgSXOsH7g/s1600/Ken%27s_Doctor_of_Metaphysics_Deploma.jpg

Deduction: Johnston merely misremembered or misspoke when he claimed the school was called the “ReformED Baptist Seminary”. In any case, Bara’s posting is tacit admission that Johnston’s original claim of the school’s name was untrue. Easy enough to fix – and no big deal, it’s why VERIFICATION is always a sensible, prudent policy.

Step three: some posters launch vicious verbal assault on Dr. Gonzales for being lazy, incompetent, arrogant, and a liar to boot.

Deduction: Dr. Gonzales’s statement was actually totally accurate, as Bara conceded in posting the corrected name of the school – another school entirely.

Step four: Having caught one error (of undetermined origin) in Johnston’s claimed credentials, just to be cautious, check out the nature of the PhD program at the institution called “The Reform Baptist Theological Seminary” in Denver, Colorado. I encourage anybody interested in the dispute to perform this step independently. The first step, I suggest, is to find it. Go and try.


===
submitted Nov 28, 12:01 PM CST

Completion of USMC jet school during the Vietnam era incurred a six year 'duty commitment' to actually fly airplanes and get a payback for the expensive program. What I can't figure out is why, a year after completing the PRE-flight portion of training, Ken is suddenly a civilian, working for Grumman -- where he becomes a "test pilot" who somehow never gets off the ground again. Now, those circumstances strike me as suggestive of significant issues that are being withheld by the parties involved.
===

As for Johnston's 'senior position until recently', you can't even seem to read Johnston's actual claims with any comprehension. He was a documentation clerk in the lunar lab, who was sent pictures by the real photo lab in another division entirely. He had no authority over Apollo photo archives. And after Apollo, he worked a series of other aerospace contractor jobs, with competence and diligence, in other space organizations.
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Philip Edwards



Joined: 20 Jun 2007
Posts: 210
Location: Cambridge/England

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JimO.

Well the next link describes my idea of Johnston, he was a manager and until recently a member of prestigious merit to NASA. But I have just read your profile and I must say I am impressed, a scientist no less, so I won't try arguing with you, you will grant me at least that Johnston once worked for NASA and perhaps that is all that matters. As for people's past records, I take the view that they will always be distorted by the powers that be, I think it is silly to think that they would not be, but in this case perhaps Johston just made a mistake, or maybe he lied but that does not mean he lied about everything else in his life and he could be part of some conspiracy!

http://npc.press.org/calendar/caldbevent.cfm?eventid=14033
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Last edited by Philip Edwards on Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:23 am; edited 1 time in total
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Carol Nistri



Joined: 16 Jun 2007
Posts: 3354

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thats always a big big problem Phil,when a person lies to you and is caught in that lie it ruins your perception of them from that point forward,its very important to try to get thru this life without the reputation as a liar,look what happend with the ex-governor of Phoenix,he was the governor when that occurance happend he came walking out with a guy in a alien suit and made light of the whole thing,ten years later he comes out and says he was lying when he said there was nothing there but flares,that he a pilot saw the object too,but it was too late his reputation for lying had been established and the result was people ignored his latest claims.
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Philip Edwards



Joined: 20 Jun 2007
Posts: 210
Location: Cambridge/England

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 7:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carol Nistri.

I think the mentality of diregarding something because of one piece of information being suspect is wrong, people also have to force themselves to use their common sense, for instance if you have been abducted by aliens and know they exist and you know that 90 percent of what someone is saying is true then to try and deny the whole of the person's claims is a bad mental habit which needs keeping in check. There can be many reasons for a false claim, weak memories, misunderstandings, etc.
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Carol Nistri



Joined: 16 Jun 2007
Posts: 3354

PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 9:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree Phil,there were those of us at the time that fully suspected the governor had been leaned on to make light of the whole thing.He chose to do so and took a position,without his confirmation this faded,he promised there was going to be an investigation,the very next day he made fun of the whole situation,thereby difussing it,that was probably the only thing to do but it got a lot of us angry.We were lied to,again.
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graylien



Joined: 01 Oct 2007
Posts: 174
Location: UK

PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 9:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.thespacereview.com/article/1022/1

Sceptical review of Hoagland's press conference.
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