Joined: 15 Jun 2007 Posts: 1334 Location: California
Posted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 3:03 pm Post subject: Let the good times roll!!
The recent offensive political cartoon about Obama and his wife made me think.....here we go again with yet another smear campaign and dirty politics!!!
I suppose it is asking too much to have a fair and honest fight for the presidency!!!
I get so tired of all the BS and mud slinging. When did we decide that insulting and offensive cartoons were acceptable???
How are WE supposed to take elections seriously if the media can smear the candidates and think it's funny??? _________________ "It's our choices that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities."
Dumbledore
to Harry Potter
Joined: 13 Jun 2007 Posts: 1510 Location: Cincinnati, OH
Posted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 3:39 pm Post subject:
I assume you're talking about the cover of The New Yorker, Scam. It is a satirical magazine and satire is covered under our First Amendment rights. If Obama and his minions aren't willing to grant everyone their right to Freedom of Speech, are you sure you want him in the White House?
Every would-be President has been roasted on a spit from time to time. This is no time to start asking people to pull their punches.
S _________________ "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have." -- Thomas Jefferson
Here's a wiki link to the definition of satire.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satire
and from Dictionary .com
1. the use of irony, sarcasm, ridicule, or the like, in exposing, denouncing, or deriding vice, folly, etc.
According to some this New Yorker instance was a poor use of satire since it's usually meant to point out the faults or foibles of someone who deserves it with the intent to improve or enlighten. Obama is not a muslim nor is his wife a terrorist. It's improper use of satire. _________________ "Some say the valley has always been haunted ever since River ran.
The rippling waters fast as the colors conceal the Green Man."
Roy Harpur from The Green Man
Joined: 13 Jun 2007 Posts: 1510 Location: Cincinnati, OH
Posted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 5:40 pm Post subject:
Doc - the First Amendment is tricky. Here in Cincinnati several years back, we had to suck it up and watch as the KKK put up a Christmastime display on a very public square downtown. It doesn't matter if the New Yorker cover doesn't fit someone's narrow definition of satire. I'm pretty sure it is not the equivalent of shouting "Fire" in a crowded theatre so your man is just going to have to butch up and take it. I'm pretty sure it will be good practice for him in dealing with the rest of the world.
S _________________ "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have." -- Thomas Jefferson
Doc - the First Amendment is tricky. Here in Cincinnati several years back, we had to suck it up and watch as the KKK put up a Christmastime display on a very public square downtown. It doesn't matter if the New Yorker cover doesn't fit someone's narrow definition of satire. I'm pretty sure it is not the equivalent of shouting "Fire" in a crowded theatre so your man is just going to have to butch up and take it. I'm pretty sure it will be good practice for him in dealing with the rest of the world.
S
This is not about a violation of the first amendment...per se. They have every right to put that cartoon on their magazine if they wish. My point ,and others who have commented on this recently ,said it's a poor/incorrect use of satire since those foibles or faults satired do not fit the Obamas. _________________ "Some say the valley has always been haunted ever since River ran.
The rippling waters fast as the colors conceal the Green Man."
Roy Harpur from The Green Man
Joined: 15 Jun 2007 Posts: 1334 Location: California
Posted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 9:08 pm Post subject:
Dr Wu said it nicely and I agree.
Satire based on lies is not funny.
I would feel the same way if their cover showed McCain as a devil worshipper and his wife as a prostitute, for instance.
Obama addressed this issue very well on Larry King Live tonight. He upholds the First Amendment right to print that....but he said he has a thick skin and is not concerned about it.
It was also pointed out that according to the false allegations going around the internet in emails, 12% of the population believe that Obama is a Muslim...he's not...and 26% believe he was raised in a Muslim home...he wasn't.
The kind of false satire the New Yorker put out only adds to the lies...and that, imo, is not fair nor in good taste. _________________ "It's our choices that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities."
Dumbledore
to Harry Potter
Joined: 17 Jun 2007 Posts: 244 Location: Berlin, Germany
Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 4:11 pm Post subject:
According to the New Yorker, the carricature is an agglomeration of all sorts of weird lies and propaganda against Obama. They are brought up in a single pic and draw an absurd picture. The absurdity of all those vicious rumours about Obama should be faced by the people. IMO this was the intention of the pic.
The problem now is, that most people are not capable to draw the right conclusions and instead insist in believing the propagaded BS. According to a recent Newsweek- poll 26 % of the American people state that Obama was educated as a Muslim and 39 % of the American people are convinced he had visited an Islamist school. Those allegations have been proved wrong repeatedly. No matter - obviously - the folks go on and believe the rubbish that had been spread. That is a fatal situation. Maybe and hopefully the satire carricature reopens a new discussion about truth and facts about Obama and expelles the lies and halftruths.
According to the New Yorker, the carricature is an agglomeration of all sorts of weird lies and propaganda against Obama. They are brought up in a single pic and draw an absurd picture. The absurdity of all those vicious rumours about Obama should be faced by the people. IMO this was the intention of the pic.
The problem now is, that most people are not capable to draw the right conclusions and instead insist in believing the propagaded BS. According to a recent Newsweek- poll 26 % of the American people state that Obama was educated as a Muslim and 39 % of the American people are convinced he had visited an Islamist school. Those allegations have been proved wrong repeatedly. No matter - obviously - the folks go on and believe the rubbish that had been spread. That is a fatal situation. Maybe and hopefully the satire carricature reopens a new discussion about truth and facts about Obama and expelles the lies and halftruths.
I still don't think Obama is an American. Arnold is way more Red White and Blue than this guy ever could dream of. He just barely squeaked through the test for citizenship and office. A few years earlier and he wouldn't have made it. Then add in the fact he was not raised in the USA, the most impressionable years of a persons life - I really don't think he deserves to call himself a citizen at all....... "Brownie" needs a green card in my books. (That is quoted because I didn't say it.)
Americans have been sailing LEFT intellectually since the words:
"You're doing a heck of a job Brownie." _________________ SOMNIUM MENS est IANUA ut INFINITIO
I'm disappointed in you Will. Your bigotry is showing.
Personally I'm sick and tired of all the flag waving red white and blue bs. _________________ "Some say the valley has always been haunted ever since River ran.
The rippling waters fast as the colors conceal the Green Man."
Roy Harpur from The Green Man
I'm disappointed in you Will. Your bigotry is showing.
Personally I'm sick and tired of all the flag waving red white and blue bs.
Then why are you in a thread discussing political cartoons in that some are very much alive with bigotry as opposed to the common "group think" of Political Correctness, which isn't correct at all. You seem to be missing the point entirely. But that is not unusual for the LLL's,
Mike (Brownie) Brown is white and was a cronie of GWB. Nothing racist at all in my quote of the comment. "Brownie, you're doing a heck of a job." —President George W. Bush, to FEMA director Michael Brown, who resigned 10 days later amid criticism over his job performance, Mobile, Ala. _________________ SOMNIUM MENS est IANUA ut INFINITIO
Joined: 17 Jun 2007 Posts: 244 Location: Berlin, Germany
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:57 am Post subject:
Will wrote:
Quote:
I still don't think Obama is an American. Arnold is way more Red White and Blue than this guy ever could dream of. He just barely squeaked through the test for citizenship and office. A few years earlier and he wouldn't have made it. Then add in the fact he was not raised in the USA, the most impressionable years of a persons life - I really don't think he deserves to call himself a citizen at all....... "Brownie" needs a green card in my books. (That is quoted because I didn't say it.)
Americans have been sailing LEFT intellectually since the words:
"You're doing a heck of a job Brownie."
Why doesn’t this surprise me?
Will, are you jumping on the band waggon of those to whom was dedicated the burning star spangled banner in the fire place?
Barry Blitts intention of the satirical carricature was to expose the dirty smear campaign of some Rebulicans, who would like to declare Obama and his wife for some radical Islamists in disguise. As it seems to me the average American isn’t really blessed with true intelectual competence and many will take the pic at face value.
Barrack Obama will be visiting Berlin for a speech at the Brandenburger Gate next week. I would go and see him, if I were here, but I’ll soon be off to the Netherlands for vacation. The Germans love Obama, but our govt. fears the side-effect of any indication that Berlin is over-eager to see the end of the Bush administration is not likely to play well in Washington.
I'm disappointed in you Will. Your bigotry is showing.
Personally I'm sick and tired of all the flag waving red white and blue bs.
Then why are you in a thread discussing political cartoons in that some are very much alive with bigotry as opposed to the common "group think" of Political Correctness, which isn't correct at all. You seem to be missing the point entirely. But that is not unusual for the LLL's,
Mike (Brownie) Brown is white and was a cronie of GWB. Nothing racist at all in my quote of the comment. "Brownie, you're doing a heck of a job." —President George W. Bush, to FEMA director Michael Brown, who resigned 10 days later amid criticism over his job performance, Mobile, Ala.
Here's your quote above:
"I still don't think Obama is an American. Arnold is way more Red White and Blue than this guy ever could dream of. He just barely squeaked through the test for citizenship and office. A few years earlier and he wouldn't have made it. Then add in the fact he was not raised in the USA, the most impressionable years of a persons life - I really don't think he deserves to call himself a citizen at all.."
"Not an American"? Sure sounds biased and a knee jerk right wing response to me. Maybe I'm missing your intent here,.... care to explain in more detail? Did you have a point to make about the cartoon or do you just want to attack Obama?
Why am I in this thread? To say that the cartoon was in poor taste and bad satire. I would think that was obvious to anyone....even 'neo-cons'.
(btw I don't consider myself a democrat or republican..frankly i'm fed up with both parties)
If they had done something similar to McCain that was in poor taste I would have also said so.
And I could care less about the idiot Dubya had appointed. He (Brownie) reflected Dubya's bad judgement imo and what in hell does that have to do with the Obama cartoon anyway? _________________ "Some say the valley has always been haunted ever since River ran.
The rippling waters fast as the colors conceal the Green Man."
Roy Harpur from The Green Man
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That is a fatal situation. Maybe and hopefully the satire carricature reopens a new discussion about truth and facts about Obama and expelles the lies and halftruths.
(btw I don't consider myself a democrat or republican..frankly i'm fed up with both parties)